Okanogan 14x24 by a lurker :)

Started by Oljarhead, September 21, 2009, 02:53:09 PM

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OlJarhead

Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 09:04:50 AM
Well, I think that might be a bit dependent on the size of the building/roof.  On mine it's only a 12 X 12, and I haven't done the calculations in a bit, but even if it was 200 gal, that would mean in the average year, I might get about 600 gallons from rain ... (It might be more, but it doesn't rain a lot up there) ... now if I could harvest the run off from the snow melt ... I'd be rich with water!  Of course, I'd have to have a place to store it all  d*

I get 12x12=144x2=288sq ft of roof x 0.6 gallons per inch and 14" per year (you might actually be more then that) for an annual yield of 2400 gallons per year off of your roof.

So, if you had a 500 gallon cistern dug into the ground with the cover set at about 15" down and a riser to ground level (so it wouldn't freeze etc) and some diverters you'd have that filled in no time!  Your biggest issue would be once it's filled you'd have to stop any more coming in.

Either that or put in a much bigger tank (like a 2500 gallon unit).

Truth is you could live a LONG time with that kind of water storage...but for weekend use 325 gallons would be more then enough.

AdironDoc

Quote from: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 08:14:34 AM

I currently have two 55 gallon barrels that I haven't installed but frankly I REALLY like the idea of an underground cistern.  For one, it won't freeze -- if it's down below the frost line like my current one you will have water year round regardless of the temperature -- and for two it takes no effort once set up.

My guest camp has two 55 gallon barrels coming off around 10ft of rain-leader. If I could do it easily, I'd bury them. If I don't continue chlorinating them, when they're opened, I notice green algae on the walls. As you added, they're frozen almost solid in winter. As for the water itself, it's not the worst for washing and flushing. Wouldn't say I'd want to drink a glass of it but then again, my water usually has hops in it.  ;D


OlJarhead

Quote from: AdironDoc on May 30, 2012, 11:36:07 AM
My guest camp has two 55 gallon barrels coming off around 10ft of rain-leader. If I could do it easily, I'd bury them. If I don't continue chlorinating them, when they're opened, I notice green algae on the walls. As you added, they're frozen almost solid in winter. As for the water itself, it's not the worst for washing and flushing. Wouldn't say I'd want to drink a glass of it but then again, my water usually has hops in it.  ;D

Crown Berkey :)  Best water filter you can buy :)  Would make that water more then drinkable!

alex trent

Yeah, if you don't get rain, water collecting is difficult to say the least.

But, on the other hand if you get even a little makes the value of collecting it greater.

Drinking water is secondary..can always use some bottles or just use beer most of the time. so, the "purity" should not be a distraction.  And as OJH says, there are som good filters out there for the small volumes of drinking water you need.

In the "Daks", if you have algae problems something is amiss.  Not sure what, but should not. Anyway, a bit of bleach is no harm and takes care of that quickly.


AdironDoc

Quote from: alextrent on May 30, 2012, 01:47:48 PM
In the "Daks", if you have algae problems something is amiss.  Not sure what, but should not. Anyway, a bit of bleach is no harm and takes care of that quickly.

I think the problem was that I hadn't been up to the guest camp in 4 weeks. Since then, it's been one hot day after another and, despite the brown sandstone plastic that's said to keep sun out, I could clearly see how bright the inside was. Warm sunny water and a month since chlorine. Not a great combo. I think at the very least, I'll put a box around them so they're in the dark and not heated by sunshine. That should reduce the amount of bleaching needed. It's one reason I agreed, underground is better. Still, great for toilets/shower/sink. For other uses, beer will suffice :D


JavaMan

Quote from: OlJarhead on May 30, 2012, 09:10:23 AM
I get 12x12=144x2=288sq ft of roof x 0.6 gallons per inch and 14" per year (you might actually be more then that) for an annual yield of 2400 gallons per year off of your roof.

So, if you had a 500 gallon cistern dug into the ground with the cover set at about 15" down and a riser to ground level (so it wouldn't freeze etc) and some diverters you'd have that filled in no time!  Your biggest issue would be once it's filled you'd have to stop any more coming in.

Either that or put in a much bigger tank (like a 2500 gallon unit).

Truth is you could live a LONG time with that kind of water storage...but for weekend use 325 gallons would be more then enough.

Shhh ... that's one of the things I was thinking of doing with the "basement" in the cabin ... waterproofing it, and using it as a cistern  ;)  Not sure that's a good idea, tho ???

OlJarhead

Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 02:47:58 PM
Shhh ... that's one of the things I was thinking of doing with the "basement" in the cabin ... waterproofing it, and using it as a cistern  ;)  Not sure that's a good idea, tho ???

Bad idea if open, good if not -- have Tom dig a hole for your cistern since he'll be there and just plan to use it some day ;) easier to have it ready when needed then have to get him back to dig one when you get a tank.

Something to think about.

JavaMan

That's one of the things I'm thinking about... as for open or not - definitely closed.  A couple years ago I drew up a plan for a place with a basement and a cistern underneath the basement! ???

Not sure what I was thinking of, but we're talking about 4 to 5 feet deep of cistern, in the order of 18' X 28' ... that's a LOT of water.   All with a concrete basement floor on top of it! :o

Yes, I do get a bit carried away sometimes.  But if I'm going to dream, I may as well dream BIG! ;D

Just did the math and that's between 15,000 gallons and 18,500 gallons - guess I wouldn't run out for a while...

OlJarhead

Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 04:17:15 PM
That's one of the things I'm thinking about... as for open or not - definitely closed.  A couple years ago I drew up a plan for a place with a basement and a cistern underneath the basement! ???

Not sure what I was thinking of, but we're talking about 4 to 5 feet deep of cistern, in the order of 18' X 28' ... that's a LOT of water.   All with a concrete basement floor on top of it! :o

Yes, I do get a bit carried away sometimes.  But if I'm going to dream, I may as well dream BIG! ;D

Just did the math and that's between 15,000 gallons and 18,500 gallons - guess I wouldn't run out for a while...

Sounds like we're birds of a feather -- I'll bring some JD to the cabin and we'll tell stories about being carried away next trip! LOL


AdironDoc

Quote from: JavaMan on May 30, 2012, 04:17:15 PM
That's one of the things I'm thinking about... as for open or not - definitely closed.  A couple years ago I drew up a plan for a place with a basement and a cistern underneath the basement! ???

P*** Poor Planning... It's the reason my 305 gallon cistern is sitting in my driveway, instead of buried in the basement. Didn't expect the first floor would go down quite as quickly as it did...  "What do you mean it won't fit through the front door?", I ended up asking the builder.  I was swearing at first.. now I just laugh.

OlJarhead

Quote from: AdironDoc on May 30, 2012, 04:48:16 PM
P*** Poor Planning... It's the reason my 305 gallon cistern is sitting in my driveway, instead of buried in the basement. Didn't expect the first floor would go down quite as quickly as it did...  "What do you mean it won't fit through the front door?", I ended up asking the builder.  I was swearing at first.. now I just laugh.

Chuckle - perhaps beside the cabin now?

OlJarhead

Trees are doing well I'm told :) 

Also have 500 feet of pipe ordered and the trackhoe reserved!  Heading up soon!

JavaMan

Quote from: OlJarhead on June 05, 2012, 03:54:24 PM
Trees are doing well I'm told :) 

Also have 500 feet of pipe ordered and the trackhoe reserved!  Heading up soon!
500 feet?!? :o

Somehow I got the impression it was shorter than that ... wow, that's a looooong pipe!

SkagitDrifter


Good discussion on the water catchment systems.  I am thinking about catching some water also but can't get by the need for some type of gutter on the eaves.  In winter months the snow will rip the gutter right off the house.  How do you guys deal with that?
Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.
Abraham Lincoln


JavaMan

Quote from: SkagitDrifter on June 06, 2012, 10:56:38 AM
Good discussion on the water catchment systems.  I am thinking about catching some water also but can't get by the need for some type of gutter on the eaves.  In winter months the snow will rip the gutter right off the house.  How do you guys deal with that?

Well, I don't know about OJH, but I haven't dealt with it yet, since the roof isn't on ! rofl  but I guess I will have to figure out something.  I'd hate to have to replace the gutters every spring.  On the shed, I'm not sure it's that important ... I could simply hang the gutters so that I could take them off in the winter (maybe), but the actual cabin - I don't know about that one.

Good question, I know I will have to think about it a bit.

OlJarhead

MountainDon addresses this in his thread -- basically you install a rail so the snow and ice go OVER the gutter and don't take it out.

Incidentally, I don't have that problem on my house and have no protection at all -- and while I DO live in a desert, we've been known to get two feet of snow  :o and it didn't take out my gutters.

MikeOnBike

Might depend on how much of this you get.


OlJarhead

That's what the rails MD put on his roof are for ;)

AdironDoc

I've got a 6 ft section of plastic rain-leader under the rear portion of my steel roof. Roof angle is 16/12, quite steep, and the leader is hidden halfway under the eave. Ice and snow seem to bend the rain-leader, which being rather pliable, just knocks out of the way and snaps back in. One Adirondack winter later..seems fine.

Now a  rain-leader crafted out of a sheet of plastic that has a tendency to curl up into a U shaped channel would be superb. Stiff enough for water, but would open for ice and snap back. Imagine there might be a market for that...

Redoverfarm

Quote from: SkagitDrifter on June 06, 2012, 10:56:38 AM
Good discussion on the water catchment systems.  I am thinking about catching some water also but can't get by the need for some type of gutter on the eaves.  In winter months the snow will rip the gutter right off the house.  How do you guys deal with that?

This is what I used.







We really haven't had a good snow to see how it is going to work.  Around here they call it "witches hat" but it is actually snow guard.  The price of snow birds are completely out of sight.  This is the next best thing that I could find at $12 for a 10' section.


OlJarhead

If I ever get my roof done I'll have to try that -- I want to get rain gutters up next year and start harvesting rain water.

OlJarhead

No excavator this weekend :(  Have to reschedule the work when my buddy can come out to operate it.  Probably just go up and try to get the water to run through the 1" enough to water each tree.

JavaMan

Bummer... can't you lay the pipe on the ground at least?  Probably not - just be one more thing for him to have to avoid when he does get there.

OlJarhead

Nah, the store will keep the pipe until I need it :)

So I'm bringing up the bathtub (finally!) and going to get the bathroom painted and the tub installed :)

I'll probably work on the greywater drain system as well.

JavaMan

Well, you'll be able to have a bath then, if you want to haul the water and heat it on the stove  :D  Just like the olden days  :)